Siobhan:

I'd like to acknowledge that this episode of the Teach NSW Podcast was recorded on the Homelands of the Darug people. I'd like to pay respect to Elders past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples listening to the Teach NSW Podcast today.

Opening credits:

Welcome to the Teach NSW Podcast, a podcast by teachers for teachers. I'm Shannon, and I'm Siobhan.

Shannon:

Hi, everyone. Welcome back to this episode of the Teach NSW Podcast. We are joined today by Alice, who is a Head Teacher - Secondary Studies at a NSW public school on the traditional lands of the Wangal and the Burramattagal people. We're so excited to have Alice here today, who is going to tell us all about using technology and how it can support you in the classroom with your teaching and learning. So, welcome Alice.

Alice:

Thank you, love to be here. Very excited.

Siobhan:

We're happy to have you. We typically like to, you know, warm our guests up and welcome them to the Teach NSW Podcast experience by asking some This or That questions. So I'd like to hit you with a couple. The first one is, SMARTboard or whiteboard?

Alice:

SMARTboard or whiteboard? Has to be one or the other? I was like, 'I need to have both.'

Siobhan:

Yeah, well, you know, happy to hear your perspective on both.

Alice:

I think, look, if it has to be one or the other, I reckon a SMARTboard. Because I think now, if you know how to use the functionality, it can work as a regular whiteboard as well. But I like to have both. I always love to be in a room where there is both, like an interactive whiteboard, a SMARTboard, interactive panel and a regular whiteboard. And what's better is if there's whiteboards for the students to use so the mini whiteboards or whiteboards.

Siobhan:

Board tables as well?

Alice:

All around the walls. Yeah.

Siobhan:

That's fun.

Alice:

Yeah, whiteboard tables are. Like, I love them.

Shannon:

Literally.

Alice:

They are so good, yeah.

Shannon:

Absolutely.

Siobhan:

Do you know what? I feel like, hands up if you've ever accidentally written on the SMARTboard thinking it was a whiteboard.

Shannon:

Guilty, guilty.

Siobhan:

I feel like teachers across the state are going to put their hand up and resonate with that one because we've all done it and been like, 'Uh oh.'

Alice:

I think, in the early days of interactive whiteboards, I'm showing my age now, so when I first started teaching, they were just being introduced to schools and there used to be signs that would be like, 'This is not a regular whiteboard.'

Siobhan:

'Do not write on the whiteboard with a whiteboard marker.'

Alice:

Exactly. 'It's an interactive whiteboard. Do not write on it.'

Siobhan:

I know. I am guilty as charged on that one. Okay, this is a contentious one, I'm assuming for you, Microsoft or Google applications?

Alice:

I use both, but I think if I have to choose one, I'll use Microsoft. So, at the moment, I tend to use Microsoft for stuff that I do in the lesson planning and things that I do for myself. And also, to work with other teachers, we use Microsoft, but my school is a Google Classroom school, I guess, so we use

Siobhan:

Same.

Alice:

Google Classroom with our students, and that works a lot better with all of the Google apps. So I use both, but, if I have to choose one, Microsoft.

Siobhan:

Microsoft. Yeah, what about you, Shannon?

Shannon:

Yeah, I come from a Microsoft school, so definitely very familiar with Microsoft. We also used Microsoft Teams, for my Stage 3 class, I've always used and what I really liked about it was the assignment part of Microsoft Teams. I don't know if you've used it, but you can basically set assignments and have a graded rubric and everything for your students. And I just love the instant feedback that you can provide.

Siobhan:

Well, guess what? You could do the same on Google Classroom, so.

Alice:

There is a rubric on Google Classroom, yes.

Shannon:

I've been schooled. I've been schooled.

Siobhan:

My brain is a Google brain. I don't know. I come to a halt sometimes when I look at some of the Microsoft applications. But I have used Teams, particularly during that learning from home period. And the assignment function is particularly useful, especially in the announcements part, as well. I like that students can also react and comment, and especially when we were learning from home, that interaction was really valuable, I feel. Probably better than the Google applications, but for me, for the most part, Google's my winner.

Alice:

With Microsoft assignments, though, I think, as a student, when you click or select ‘turn in’, it has this emoji that comes up, a party emoji.

Siobhan:

Well, that's cool.

Alice:

It's like, confetti. You ‘turn in’, and it's confetti thrown all over the screen, like, 'You've turned in your assignment.'

Shannon:

Oh, it feels like extrinsic motivation.

Alice:

That's right.

Shannon:

'I'm getting a fun little emoji. I'm having a good time.'

Siobhan:

Maybe I'll be converted. Next one, more subject specific, would you rather run a science practical lesson or a science theory lesson?

Alice:

Science practical.

Siobhan:

Yeah?

Alice:

Yeah, they're always fun. Smarties is something that is quite a versatile material, and there's always so many different practicals with Smarties and just food items in general, like chocolate chip cookies. We do a mining practical

Siobhan:

I've seen that before.

Alice:

Where you model how you extract your choc chips from the chocolate chip cookies. And you're extracting all your minerals or whatever metals you're mining from the land and you try to put it back together and you learn that it never is the same again. You can rehabilitate it, but it's not going to be the same again. Yeah, there's so many different things you can do for science practicals.

Shannon:

I feel like we should have brought some Smarties along.

Siobhan:

Have a little demo.

Shannon:

We could have done a lesson on demand.

Siobhan:

I know. How do you go on the old Bunsen burner, Alice?

Alice:

Oh, Bunsen burner is still the best thing. Even though, I think, a lot of sciences in the workplace don't really use Bunsen burners anymore. But you know, it’s like,

Shannon:

You can't take them away from our childhood memories.

Alice:

It's the highlight of everyone's high school experience. The Year 7s still love getting their Bunsen burner licences. They get so excited.

Shannon:

It's like a rite of passage.

Alice:

It is.

Shannon:

It's like getting a pen licence in primary school.

Alice:

That's right, yeah.

Shannon:

You have to go through the Bunsen burner in high school.

Siobhan:

And I feel like you need to spend at least a good 10 to 15 minutes on telling them how to light a match as well, ‘Away from the body, away.’

Alice:

That's right, yes, yes.

Siobhan:

And then you still get the towards. So avoiding that at all costs, I think. Yeah, I think I would love to run a science practical myself.

Alice:

Yeah, science prac and, you know, the safety glasses.

Siobhan:

Oh, the whole kit, yeah.

Alice:

Very fashionable.

Shannon:

What about the coats? Do you have a coat that you wear?

Alice:

I have a coat with my name on it, and the kids always ask, 'When are we going to get our lab coats with our own names on it?'

Shannon:

'When you guys go to uni and become a science teacher as well, you can have a coat.'

Siobhan:

Very fashion forward. I like that. And last one, marking or lesson prep?

Alice:

I think I like lesson planning more. I know they both serve their purposes, obviously, but lesson planning, I find it to be a very creative process. So, when you're trying to figure out how to best deliver that lesson or best to get that message across, there's so much creativity in lesson planning. So definitely, lesson planning.

Siobhan:

That's a good one. What about you Shannon?

Shannon:

Yeah, I really like what you just said about the creativity. I think your greatest ideas for a lesson sometimes come to you at the most obscure times.

Siobhan:

Oh 100%, when you’re like driving to work in the car, and you hear something on the radio.

Shannon:

Yeah always, or you see something, and you're like, 'Oh, that would be a really good way to explain, I don't know, motion, or something like that.’ For me, the creativity in teaching and the way you can show students how to understand something in the most obscure way because you know your students and how they learn, that's the part I enjoy.

Siobhan:

For me, I can see, like I love that creative side of lesson prep, but I also think it's the way you frame the marking in terms of the feedback process. So for me, I particularly enjoy doing a face-to-face, almost like a one-on-one conferencing style of feedback so that it makes my marking feel worthwhile. I'm not just going to mark it, give it back, and say, 'Have a great time. Miss just spent hours pouring her heart and soul into writing feedback for you.' But it's how they engage with the feedback process, which I think is a step above and why I like that part. Makes my work feel worthwhile, you know?

Alice:

Yeah, and students really value that one-on-one feedback.

Shannon:

Absolutely.

Alice:

Yeah, yeah, they were actually, I think, more likely to act on the feedback when you tell them about it rather than just reading it.

Siobhan:

100%. Well, thank you for sharing your This or That. Think we'll jump into the meat of the podcast now, but it would be great for our listeners to hear, who is Alice? What's your journey within the education space?

Alice:

So, I've been teaching for 16 years now. So, I first entered, I guess, my teaching journey after receiving a Future Teacher Scholarship so I got that at the end of Year 12. So, I think, between graduating from Year 12 to starting my initial teacher education. And I think teaching was just something that I always wanted to do. It's always been one of those careers. I'd go, 'I wouldn't mind being a teacher. I really like to actually explore that aspect.' And then I had a fantastic teacher in high school, so I had her every year from Year 8

Siobhan:

Oh wow.

Alice:

To Year 12.

Shannon:

Wow.

Alice:

Yeah, so Ms Andre, if you're out there, a big shout-out to you. So, I had her for science, Year 8, 9, and 10 and then biology in Year 11 and 12. And she was one of the people who just inspired me to become a teacher. Because she made me love biology and she was just a nice human being and someone that you just looked up to. So, I decided to become a teacher, got the Future Teacher Scholarship, did my 5 years of university sort of pre-service teacher training, and then had my first teaching experience at Rose Bay Secondary College. So, that was only for 4 weeks at the end of the school year, which was really interesting. And then my first, I guess ongoing work at a school was at Auburn Girls High School. So, I spent 3 years there as a Science Teacher, I was a Year Advisor. I got to do some experiences as a relieving Head Teacher - Science, and relieving Head Teacher - Welfare. And then went to Merrylands High School as a science head teacher, did a whole bunch of stuff with whole-school technology, and then went into curriculum support with the Department of Education. So, I was the Stage 6 Advisor for about 18 months, supporting teachers across the state to implement the current set of HSC syllabuses for English, science, maths and history. And then moved to where I am now as Head Teacher - Secondary Studies. So it's been a lot of different experiences and a lot of different contexts.

Shannon:

It's like almost, there's current research at the moment that stipulates students that we're teaching at the moment at present will have about 6 to 7 careers in their lifetime, but it seems that you've had 6 to 7 careers within education,

Siobhan:

Just within this space.

Shannon:

Just within the Department of Education, which is a phenomenal full circle, I suppose.You've got to dip in and out, and I think that's the thing about teaching. The doors that it opens are quite endless with the opportunities that it provides.

Alice:

And that's right. I think I've read somewhere or heard from someone saying that there's over 2,200 public schools

Shannon:

There are. Correct.

Alice:

In New South Wales.

Shannon:

Yep.

Alice:

So there's so many different opportunities, and you've got your high schools, your central schools, your creative performing arts high schools. You've got all these different types of schools, so it's like having those different career opportunities but still with the same employer, so I think that's amazing.

Shannon:

Yeah, absolutely. As well, because you have experienced such different contexts across different schools within the NSW public school system, how have you found your experiences, going from different schools? What was it like moving into a new context each time?

Alice:

I think every school has its own routines, own processes, own different, unique, sort of community needs. And I think moving from Auburn Girls, which had a high population of students who were learning English as an additional language or dialect. A lot of them came from refugee-like experiences. And then moving to Merrylands High School, which had a similar context but was a bit different as well, you gain different skill sets from those different contexts, which is why I love, I guess, my journey so far. You pick up different experiences with different things and you meet different students. You meet different families, different communities, and there's a whole lot of different things that they bring to the table, and you just learn so much at every context.

Shannon:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

I think moving around the system is really valuable because it doesn't give you that sort of, I suppose, microcosm lens of what one school is and to me, oh, that's what NSW public schools are. I think moving around and jumping between contexts, I've done it myself, starting out at an academically selective school and then moving to a junior campus in quite a significantly multicultural area as well has given me that broad understanding. And now working in the education support space as well, you kind of just see the other side to it, so that journey through the department, I think, to me, is, like Shannon was saying, many careers in one.

Alice:

Definitely, yeah.

Siobhan:

Definitely opens the doors.

Alice:

Yeah, and as you pick up new skills in each context, you become a better teacher. So, you build up that toolkit, so you've got strategies for teaching all different types of students, all different types of needs. And I think, overall, working in those different contexts, yeah, you become a better teacher and you build on your existing skill sets and experiences.

Shannon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Siobhan:

Just jumping back to, because you mentioned you were the recipient of a Future Teacher Scholarship, jumping back to that, how did that scholarship sort of support you through your studies? And what would you say to someone in a position like yours considering applying for one?

Alice:

Oh, definitely apply for one. It was a pivotal moment when I got that scholarship. I remember getting that phone call and I was so excited. I think the 2 really big benefits from the scholarship, number one is definitely the financial support. With the scholarship,I was able to pay all of my HECS upfront.

Siobhan:

Wonderful.

Alice:

So I finished up my university degree and walked out with a Bachelor of Education, a Bachelor of Science, and no HECS debt.

Shannon:

Amazing.

Siobhan:

Thank you to the department.

Alice:

That is a huge advantage, when you leave uni with no HECS debt. The other really huge advantage is I was guaranteed a full-time permanent position within the public school system. And that took a lot off my mind, I guess, when I was at university. Like I knew I was going to be placed in a school. It was really good because straight away, you had your own classes. You had a consistent school. You had, for me, a head teacher - science, a consistent deputy principal, consistent principal, and the whole mentoring process as you're trying to find your way into teaching. That first year is critical and I think having that consistency, because you were placed in a permanent position straight away, made a huge difference to the start of my career.

Shannon:

Absolutely, and before you were in your permanent position, you did some casual teaching, didn't you?

Alice:

I did, yeah. It was casual teaching, 4 weeks, at the end of the school year, yeah.

Shannon:

Well, it's good. You got to experience that as well

Alice:

Exactly, yeah, yeah.

Shannon:

And I suppose that's a good thing, also, with the department, how there's the flexibility of, you know, if you want to teach casually, you have that option.

Alice:

That's right.

Shannon:

If you want to teach in a temporary capacity, that might look like 4 weeks to a 12 month contract at a school, or you do have the option for ongoing permanent employment as well.

Alice:

Yeah, I've got so many colleagues who choose to be casual or who are on temporary engagements because it suits their needs at the moment. I think, like you said, it's the variety of opportunities. There's something for everyone at every sort of stage of their lives.

Shannon:

Oh yes, and life throws some curveballs.

Alice:

That's right.

Shannon:

So it's nice to have those options.

Siobhan:

Well, shall we talk tech?

Alice:

Yes.

Shannon:

Yes, let's talk tech. I'm excited.

Siobhan:

Yeah, I mean, where do we start? What's your top tech tool at the moment?

Alice:

My top tech two, tool. 'Top tech tool.'

Siobhan:

'Top Tech Tools with Alice.'

Alice:

My top tech tool.

Shannon:

New segment.

Alice:

OneNote.

Shannon:

Ah, yes! I love OneNote!

Siobhan:

Music to Shannon's ears.

Shannon:

Yes, let's talk all about it.

Siobhan:

Convert me.

Shannon:

Go on, Alice, tell me.

Alice:

I think OneNote. I know there's OneNote Class Notebook, which is a little bit different to OneNote just on its own. And I'm just going to talk about OneNote on its own. That's the one that I use the most, and I use it as my digital teacher planner. So, when I first started teaching, I had the physical teacher diary and when OneNote, and you know, this technology, became a bit more advanced and more frequent in the classroom for both teachers and students, I started using OneNote. And it's so good because I have a lot of random thoughts, like what we were talking about before. You just get random thoughts pop into your head. On the couch watching TV, brushing your teeth, all these ideas! And I love OneNote because I've got it on my laptop, I've got it on my iPad, I've got it on my phone, and it just syncs across everything. So when I'm having a random thought on the couch, watching a show, I'll just enter it in my OneNote on my phone, and it will sync across to everything. So it just keeps everything in the one place. And also really love the digital ink functions on OneNote, and I use it with my Surface Pen and also with my Apple Pencil, so it's very versatile across different types of devices. And it's just really good to scan or take a picture of a student work sample.

Shannon:

And then you can annotate it.

Alice:

Yeah circle, annotate. You can do audio/voice recording for comments if you want to. There's stickers in OneNote.

Shannon:

Oh yes.

Siobhan:

That's fun.

Shannon:

Yes, I love that.

Alice:

You can colour code everything and change the colours. It's just so good.

Shannon:

You can create your own digital teacher stamps. I got really hyperfixated on those, and I was using Canva to create those. And I would use my little emoji of myself.

Alice:

Yes, yeah, yeah!

Shannon:

And my students just would flip out over that because it would just show up on their OneNote page. I like how you were talking about taking the pictures. You can directly take a photo in OneNote of a work sample of a student's work and upload it into your assessment section within your OneNote and annotate as you go.

Siobhan:

Is that what the digital ink function is?

Shannon:

Yeah, and it just makes it, I feel like it just makes it so seamless for you to be able to do that as well, and it's all there, kept in a safe place, in the cloud.

Alice:

That's right. You never lose it.

Shannon:

Never.

Siobhan:

As an English teacher, that's just ringing alarm bells but positive alarm bells for me. Because often we do a lot of annotation of texts, so yeah, I'm thinking right now, if I was a teacher using OneNote, I would probably, scan a few poems, take a photo of a few poems, place the poem or whatever text is in there. And students can work in groups?

Shannon:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

Can they do group work through OneNote?

Alice:

Yeah, they can, yeah, yeah.

Siobhan:

There you go. I could model what I would use for my annotation first, probably project it onto the board, and show them how to use the digital ink function and what my annotations are going to look like.

Siobhan:

And then I would send them off, and assuming, can you jump into each of their pages, as well?

Alice:

Yes, yes, yes.

Siobhan:

Then you can monitor what they're doing and how they're going.

Alice:

You can check their books, their virtual books, anytime, anywhere.

Siobhan:

I like that.

Alice:

If you actually share the OneNote with the students or set it up as a collaboration space when you are annotating the work samples of, like you know, the what a good one looks like, they can actually also see it live on their screens, as well. So it's really good.

Shannon:

And I feel like the mathematics tools that are on there. Like, they've got a little ruler. They've got, like, if you're drawing a circle, because I always feel like this is a point of contention, how you draw a circle on the board. 'Miss, it's an oval.'

Siobhan:

'It's a bit crooked.'

Shannon:

'That's not a circle.' I'm like, 'I'm not an artiste.' But they have a tool where, if you draw a circle, it'll fix it for you. And, if you draw a square, it'll fix it for you. Gorgeous, especially for your Venn diagrams.

Siobhan:

Mmm, chef's kiss.

Shannon:

Really, really helpful. And then you can draw all over it, but you can, you were saying you haven't had as much experience with Class Notebook. Class Notebook I think it's called.

Alice:

Yeah, OneNote, yeah, Class Notebook.

Shannon:

So, you can set it up for your class, and each of them have an individual student page, but there's also a collaboration space and you can basically create the page that you want everyone to have. So say I had something in mathematics that I had my questions all detailed on and I wanted to share it to all of them to do independent work. I can basically copy that one page and it will duplicate across all of the students' files so they can't see each other's work.

Siobhan:

I was about to ask, is it locked for each other?

Shannon:

Yeah, but they can see in the collaboration space altogether. So, it's really, like the functionality of it is quite endless and I feel like they're always

Siobhan:

Love.

Shannon:

Adding new features, and yeah, it's really cool.

Alice:

Have you tried the ink recording function?

Shannon:

No, I haven't.

Alice:

It's really good for maths. So, I teach chemistry. There's a lot of math in chemistry as well, and it's really good to show, I guess, working out, so as you're writing it, it will actually record it, so you can actually play it back. So, the way you set it is so that the students will actually see you as you're writing it out, not just all in one go.

Shannon:

Oh, so see like the method you use, how you sort of go through the steps.

Alice:

So instead of seeing one massive working out of 10 lines,

Shannon:

That's amazing.

Alice:

They will see you writing as you go

Siobhan:

Line by line.

Alice:

So, it just breaks it down for them, yeah.

Shannon:

That's really cool.

Alice:

Yes, it is.

Shannon:

See? You learn something new every day. Are you converted yet? Or what?

Siobhan:

I think I might be.

Shannon:

We might need another hour because I love OneNote. Biggest fan.

Siobhan:

So, Alice, I'd be interested to hear if you have implemented or engaged your students with a project that is heavily tech-based within your classroom?

Alice:

So, one project that is quite heavily tech-based is with my Year 11 and 12 chemistry classes. So, one of the things that we do is for the students to create a video lesson for their peers. So, they're sort of like Eddie Woo, and they pick a concept that is complex for other people to understand. So, it could be acids and bases or particular complex pH calculation problems that they can take their peers through. And they use either Microsoft PowerPoint or some sort of Canva for Education. I think Google Slides now has introduced an audio recording and a video recording option.

Siobhan:

Yes, yeah

Alice:

Yeah, so, whatever tools they want, and they get to choose where their strengths are, or they can just have someone film them with a whiteboard, like Eddie Woo. They script it. They record it. They edit it. And then they publish it. And it's there for their peers for all of their classes afterwards as well, so it's one that they really enjoy doing. And I think going through that whole recording process really gets them to think about, 'How am I going to communicate that?' Because, when you're talking to a classmate, you're just talking to them and there's a free flow of thoughts. But when you have to capture it in a video that's got a time restriction on it, you really have to think about what are the most critical elements of this concept? Or, if I'm showing how to work out a mathematical problem, what are the steps that I'm going to take and how will I actually visually communicate that?

Shannon:

And all the skills. So you've got your core content there that you're teaching your students. But look at all those skills around that that they're sort of incidentally learning and evolving with when they're doing such a project. That's really cool.

Siobhan:

And it's a fabulous revision tool, right?

Shannon:

Absolutely.

Siobhan:

They can go back onto their learning platform and have a look at it for years to come or when it's exam time and they're cramming, no doubt. They can watch their friends teaching them a tutorial of acids and bases and be like, 'Oh, makes sense to me now.' I love that.

Shannon:

That's really cool.

Siobhan:

That's great.

Shannon:

And just touching on beginning teachers and I suppose tech tools that maybe you might be looking at implementing in your classroom around behaviour management. So, I know something that you and I have discussed before. You have a certain website in mind that you may use in your classroom.

Alice:

I love Bouncy Balls, and that's just Google 'Bouncy Balls’. It will just come up straight away as the first search result. And there's no signup, no logins, and it's a great tool to manage the voice volume levels in your class, especially for group work situations. So, I think we all know that, when it's in group work, one group will start to talk a bit louder to be heard, I don't know, amongst the other group. So then the next group will also then talk a little bit louder to overcome the first group and, before you know it, it's a full-on sort of stadium voice level situation.

Shannon:

We've spiralled.

Alice:

So, Bouncy Balls is one where you can set, I guess, the sensitivity levels of how much noise you want. And then once it gets beyond that level, the balls will just bounce all over the screen, and it will go quiet. So it's a great way for the kids to just visually monitor and just self-monitor their own volume levels. And it's great.

Shannon:

And it takes that onerous element off you, as well, as the teacher, so you can be facilitating with your groups and that behaviour management is running itself. I really like that.

Alice:

Yeah, that's right, yeah.

Shannon:

That's a great tool.

Siobhan:

I've done something similar on Classroom Screen. So, you can set up a visual timer, but you can also have a noise level calculator. And if it goes over the part that I've ticked it as an acceptable level of noise, it just makes a little ‘ding’.

Shannon:

They've also got those icons that you can set on Classroom Screen, and it tells them, individual work, group work time as well. So, those visual cues are just so helpful for everyone. Everyone in the classroom, everyone in the audience.

Siobhan:

I think it's also really important that we touch on, some schools don't have a BYOD policy.

Alice:

That's right.

Siobhan:

So what are some of your baseline technology tools that you would use, perhaps just projected onto your SMARTboard or something like that within your classroom that then students could go off and use within just their written notebooks? Do you have any

Alice:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

Tech tools that are really screaming out to you? I mean, everybody knows about Kahoot! and things like that.

Alice:

Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I use Blooket. Yeah, Blooket is a really good one to use. And a lot of the times even though my school is 100% BYOD and every child has their own laptop. A lot of the times, they will just want to team up in Blooket just to make sure they win.

Shannon:

That's cool.

Alice:

And it's one that's really good because you can import your Quizlet decks into Blooket. So, I use Quizlet a lot for like vocab work

Shannon:

That's great.

Alice:

Or in chemistry, for them to just really memorise all of their chemical symbols and all that sort of stuff. So, you set it up already, you import it into Blooket and it generates a whole lot of different games. So, there's one called 'Crypto Hack’, which the younger years really love. My Year 7s love that. My Year 11s, for some reason, really like Fishing. And then my Year 7s always say, 'Fishing? Hate that game.'

Shannon:

'You wait a few years. You'll love it soon.'

Alice:

Yeah, so, they love Fishing, and this is a really great fun way for them to just engage with those concepts that they do need to have that fluency, have to have that in their long-term memory, and have it memorised, yeah.

Siobhan:

I think that's a really great work around, if your school has a certain number of devices to use across the faculty. I know the school that I work at certainly does. And so, you could even split half. Shannon's class can have half the devices

Alice:

That's right.

Siobhan:

And my class could have half the devices and our students could pair up to complete the activity. Just because you perhaps have restrictions on tech doesn't mean that you can't use tech in the classroom.

Alice:

That's right. Yeah, and a very simple way to do it, I guess, sometimes Google Classroom, I have every single lesson up on Google Classroom, even if I don't use any tech, the students are not using any tech. So, things like, having the lesson title, the lesson date, the learning intention, success criteria, all the hard copy worksheets or notes that they're using, all up there and you just have it projected on the screen. And I think, for those, some of those students, if they see the visual of what they should be working on, they know what they're working on. So, that's really handy, especially, I think for a high school situation where my high school, we are moving from room to room, every 50 minutes and for everything, just to be ready. All of your files up, you're not digging through your File Explorer. 'Or is it in my OneNote? Is it in this? Is it in that?’ It’s just all up on the Google Classroom post.' And just, you know one, just connect your laptop to the screen, and that's it.

Shannon:

That's right.

Alice:

Everything is ready.

Siobhan:

And you can actually schedule your posts on Google Classroom

Alice:

That's right, yes.

Siobhan:

And, I'm assuming, on Microsoft as well.

Alice:

Yes.

Siobhan:

So, yeah, for me, a lot of the time, one of my Year 8 classes, in particular, liked exit tasks. So I would always schedule, 10 minutes before I knew the period would end, I would just, before the day, a week earlier, a month earlier if I wanted to, you could schedule the exit slip to come out. And then the students can fill it out at the end of the lesson. Another really easy way to save yourself time but also have the students engaged on tech as well.

Shannon:

And provide that assessment snapshot too of their learning, which is cool. I liked what you were saying about, obviously different schools, different contexts, different technology that's accessible. Sometimes, as well, in the primary school space, even though, so at my school, we had, I think we had 16 devices per class, but then we also had BYOD. But sometimes, I wanted to channel those 21st century learning skills, collaboration, for example, and I didn't want one-to-one devices. And I think flipping that narrative, as well, and showcasing, to your students, that working together in a group in one device. You might find yourself in a boardroom one day, and you might need to work with your colleagues in that sense.

Alice:

That's right, yeah.

Shannon:

So, just flipping that narrative, I think you can use that as a social success criteria almost, as well, for your students, which is cool.

Siobhan:

And because you worked in that EAL/D context, I'd be interested to hear if you had any, tech-specific or tech-rich tools that were useful for that context of students?

Alice:

I know some of my students would use some of the translation apps. I think Google Translate has come such a long way since when it was first released. So, for some of those students who are still at the earlier levels of their English acquisition and proficiency, those translation apps can be really, really useful for them. Just to know what the basic instructions are in the classroom and what they should be doing. The voice-to-text apps, and there's so many of them now. In OneNote, there's voice-to-text and, I think in almost all of the word processing tools now. And that's not only just for students learning English as an additional language. For a lot of students who just have difficulty or just need some help with just putting their thoughts into writing. Those voice-to-text tools

Shannon:

It's a really good point.

Alice:

it supports them a lot and allows you to really differentiate for them and you know meet their needs.

Shannon:

And as a teacher, at the end of my day, I would use voice-to-text for my registrations.

Siobhan:

Ah, clever.

Shannon:

I thought it was quite clever.

Alice:

I didn't know that.

Shannon:

Yeah, so my school used a OneNote template for our unit of work. And at the bottom, when I would do my registration, I would just voice-to-text on my phone

Siobhan:

Yeah, that's clever.

Shannon:

Because it was fresh in my mind. I think, for me, sometimes, it was the mental thing of sitting down, having to type my registration. There was just something that would block me. And then once I started doing that, I was laughing. I'd be tidying up my room and talking through my thoughts on my phone. It was recording it all for me.

Siobhan:

It's like sending a voice note to your friend, but there you go, you're doing.

Shannon:

Big fan. It's like podcasting and then it goes into text.

Siobhan:

I love that.

Shannon:

But yeah, it saved me a lot of time, and I think it just made it more of a seamless, and I would do the same thing if I had an idea for my learning intention or anything really. I would voice-to-text, and it became a real habit of mine.

Siobhan:

Another thing that's just come to mind for me is I feel like sometimes people can be negative around tech in that students are inside and they're bogged down with their device and they're not speaking to people and things like that. So for me, I often like to take the tech outside and have activities that involve us doing a lesson outdoors but also implementing tech. So, in English, when we typically do a film unit, we study camera angles and shots, so I would often group the students up together, send them outside and tell them to set up a set of scenes. And get them to take a photo on the shared device using your high-angle shot, your low-angle shot, your bird’s-eye view, get them to do a panning shot as well. So that they are engaging with each other outdoors but also putting tech into the lesson seamlessly. So, I think I just wanted to dispel that myth, I suppose, that tech has to just be within the classroom and students bogged down in the laptop or device or whatever they're using. But I think you can really be creative with it and find that happy medium, I suppose, outdoors. I'd be interested to hear if you have a similar lesson that you've done.

Alice:

Outdoor lessons with tech. Yeah, well, in science when we do motion or things like speed and we're doing experiments outside to measure average speed, definitely. You take your tech outside. You have all of your investigation reports, all your instructions, and you get these students to run, or they're flying a paper plane to measure the distance. And just enter all that into a spreadsheet and all that sort of stuff. Yeah, so it's all there.

Shannon:

Yeah, no, I really, we did a, with one of my Stage 3 classes, it was for geography, and they were sort of grouped in like a jigsaw manner. So then they all came together and taught each other something. But basically, they had to create a tour guide approach for a different country in Asia. So I then embedded, we used these EV robots, the LEGO EV. I don't know if you've ever heard of them. They build them and then they can follow sensors with red and blue texta.

Alice:

Oh yeah, yeah.

Shannon:

So, the students had to map out the locations on the ground, they had like a poster and code the EV robot to move to the different locations while they were presenting their tour. So then they would showcase, 'Oh, okay, now we've landed in Dubai,' for example. But it was really cool to bring that outside and then spread them all out. It also really helped with the Bluetooth connectivity because they weren't all in the one classroom space. I was able to place them around the, we had like a COLA at my school. It was a covered area where we'd have assemblies. And that way there was no Bluetooth interference because everyone had their own space.

Alice:

There's a lot of iPad apps as well, I think. I keep coming back to motion, but they can measure, if you throw a ball up vertically in the air, they'll be able to take a lot of, I guess, shots of where the ball is and then give you things, like maximum velocity, all that sort of stuff. And they will graph it for you, and you can combine your physics and your maths together.

Shannon:

Yeah, so cool and so hands on.

Alice:

It is, yeah.

Shannon:

I just imagine the students would just thrive. They'd be loving life.

Siobhan:

I like that. This episode is just a tech brain dump of things that we've done. I've like used, okay, so, on your Staff portal, there's a whole range of apps that you can access for free through the Department of Education. One of them is Minecraft for Education.

Alice:

Oh yeah, love Minecraft.

Siobhan:

So, anything from, in the Sustainable Biomes unit in geography, I got my students to build their own biome within Minecraft. I got students to replicate a scene from a novel. So, from Of Mice and Men, I had them replicate different locations across the novel.

Shannon:

I did that book in Year 12.

Siobhan:

Yeah, and then annotate the text within Minecraft as well. So, I think that I'd like to make people aware that there are a lot of free applications that you can use within the classroom. There's no need to go out of your own way and purchase something for your students to use when there's a whole range of tools that you can access for free. Canva, as well, for

Shannon:

Canva for Education.

Alice:

Oh, Canva for Education. I love Canva.

Shannon:

Yeah, it's fantastic, isn't it?

Alice:

Yes, it makes everything beautiful.

Shannon:

I know. We're living in such an aesthetically pleasing world using Canva.

Siobhan:

Templates, templates, templates, templates.

Alice:

Yeah, that's right, and yeah, I've used Canva with my students for infographics, so I think that's one of the ways that tech has really opened up how students showcase their learning. So, it is not just writing something anymore and handing it in to the teacher. It's about creating things that they can showcase too, to the public or to a specific audience. And I think infographics is a great way for them to really think about, 'How do I actually communicate my understanding in a way that has minimal amounts of text and have all the supporting graphics that are meaningful and add meaning to the text?' So, yeah, love Canva.

Siobhan:

That's right.

Shannon:

Just creating those marketers of the future.

Siobhan:

Well, to me, technology is the biggest factor that I use to differentiate within my classroom. So, obviously, tech, you can differentiate the product that the students

Alice:

That's right.

Siobhan:

Are producing, exactly what you're saying, Alice. Sure, one student might want to present a page of notes, and they've handwritten and done a lot of creative craft on there. But then they might want to hop on and create an infographic, or they might want to do a voice, like video recording to present that as well. Have you had experience in implementing podcasting in your classrooms?

Alice:

Not personally. So, I haven't personally created a podcast, but I work very closely with the teacher librarian at my school.

Siobhan:

There you go.

Alice:

And we've got a podcasting kit in the library for all teachers to use. And we've had our, I think they're music students or they're creative and performing art student leaders, create a podcast about all of the fantastic music ensembles and different things that's happening in our school.

Shannon:

Amazing. So, we've obviously bounced around, brain dumped, 'We love this. You love that.' I think, if we bring it back to advice for a beginning teacher, for example, because we have a couple of years' experience between us all under our belts and, sometimes, as you start teaching, it's like, 'Oh, there are so many things. But what should I really hone in on?'

Siobhan:

'What's best?'

Shannon:

'And what should I focus on?' So what advice would you give to a beginning teacher for 'Tech Tools with Alice?’

Alice:

Advice I would give to a beginning teacher. I think the first thing is to find out what tech the school is already using. So, I think earlier we talked about Microsoft or Google, and most schools use both, but with their students, they would tend to use one. So, some schools tend to be more Microsoft Teams and OneNote. Other schools are Google Classroom so find out what the students are already used to, because they already know that so it's not another hurdle you have to teach them, so you can just get on with the learning. So find that out first, and I think the next tip is, I guess, not to be afraid to try things, even though if you're not confident with it yourself. I'm going to bring back to the Minecraft for Education that you were talking about before. So, with one of my Year 9 classes, I was team teaching history, and they were doing something that involved gladiators, and we actually recreated what a gladiator fight would be. So, they recreated the venue and what the processes would be like, and I have no idea how to control the whole Minecraft Education environment. But there were students who did, so I had those student technology leaders to really just basically run the whole Minecraft while me and the history teacher ran the class and the history content. So a lot of the time, the students will know a bit more than you in the tech, and you know a bit more than them in some other aspects. And just work with them, and yeah, they'll be able to help you. And also, I guess my final thing would be the tech aspect. So, know all the, I guess, technical pain points that sometimes will stop students from accessing whatever it is that you're trying to get them to do. So, for me, for my school, we BYOD. So, there's something called Internet at the Edge that the students have to log into every single day before they can access the department WiFi. And often, things don't work, because they haven't done that, so I was going, 'Detnsw.net.' That will solve 99.99% of your problems.

Shannon:

I had it written on my window in that like chalk.

Alice:

Yeah, I've got a poster hung up, 'Detnsw.net.'

Shannon:

We just point to it. They put their hand up, 'It's not working.' And I'm like, 'Come on.'

Alice:

If they don't do it, they can still access their Google Classroom and things, but once they try to click on the slides or the document, it will just go, 'Nah, can't do it.'

Shannon:

'No internet, no access.'

Alice:

And they're like, 'What?' I'll be like, 'Detnsw.net. Have you done that today?'

Shannon:

That's a really good point.

Alice:

'Oh.'

Shannon:

When you were saying ‘barriers’, the first thing that popped into my head

Siobhan:

Oh my gosh, are you thinking, '3, 2, one, charge the device?’

Shannon:

Yeah!

Siobhan:

I knew it.

Shannon:

I was like, 'Make sure you charge the devices.' There's been so many times that I've had, in my opinion, the best lesson ever planned, and I go to orchestrate it, and half the devices are not working.

Alice:

That's right.

Shannon:

And then we have to find power points around the room, get the chargers, and it's just a hullabaloo, so, yeah.

Siobhan:

I think, yeah, as a beginning teacher, if you're establishing classroom expectations, I would implement tech as one of your expectations. 'Okay, we're using technology within my lessons. You need to come prepared with X, Y, Z.' My students knew that they needed their device and a workbook because on any given day, I could flip between the 2, just use one or the other, but their laptops or devices always had to be charged. And that was, yeah, the expectation that I had from the get go. So I'd recommend to beginning teachers

Shannon:

Set those routines early and expectations.

Alice:

Definitely, yeah, just like how, I think a lot of teachers will practise routines in how to set up your exercise book. Red pen, margin, 2 centimetres, or whatever it is, double-line headings, date next to it. You would do the same thing with technology. So, I know with, at my school you do bring your laptops. The kids do bring their laptops, but they know to leave it in their bags until the teacher tells them to take it out. A lot of our teachers will say, 'Oh, laptops down or around.' So, that is the same phrase that is being used across all different lessons so they know that is when

Siobhan:

That's really effective.

Alice:

They need to, if they've got a laptop that can be three-quarters down because, if you fully close it, they don't like it.

Siobhan:

I know.

Alice:

It just goes to sleep, they've put a log back on, so three-quarter closed, it means that they can't see it but it still stays logged in. And for those students, who may have devices, like Surface Pros, that don't close three-quarters, they'll just turn it around so the screen faces the teacher. So they know all of those routines. And it just makes the whole lesson smoother because they know it.

Shannon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Siobhan:

That was the best piece of advice I was given on my practicum placement, as well, 'Come up with a lid strategy. So, where do you want the lid to be in that given time?' And then I think it does really help and it sets the scene for the rest of the lesson, so.

Alice:

Another tip will be to show your students that you know how to switch desktop screens on their particular device. So, in a high school context, like my school, the students like some of them bring Microsoft Surface Books. Some of them have MacBooks, and you just show them that you know how to switch desktop screens on their laptop so they're not trying to hide their other distractions. They go, 'Oh, Miss knows,' 'Sir knows.' 'Yep.'

Shannon:

Stay one step ahead, always.

Alice:

That's right. Just let them know, 'I know what you're doing.'

Shannon:

Oh, I love it. That's really cool. So, in your current role as a Head Teacher - Secondary Studies, do you also with your whole school technology, do you also get to lead professional learning in that area at your school?

Alice:

Yeah, definitely, and that's one of my favourite areas, even though I love resetting the WiFi router and all that sort of stuff.

Shannon:

All that good stuff.

Siobhan:

Sounds fun.

Alice:

Yeah, finding spare HDMI cables for teachers. The professional learning part is one of my favourite aspects of that role. And it's showing other teachers what is working in your classroom and then just letting them know, adapt it to what works for them. So, I think that's one of the key aspects, that it's about supporting your colleagues to find different ways of working and trying to fit it into how they work and how their students work. So there's always no one-size-fits-all. It’s known that everyone's OneNote looks very different.

Shannon:

Oh absolutely.

Alice:

Yeah, so, it's about just leveraging the technology to make things better for you and your students.

Shannon:

Yeah, and I like how you said that like using technology to streamline our lives and make things a little bit easier, you know?

Alice:

That's right.

Shannon:

Why not? Let the tools work for us.

Alice:

That's right. Yep, that's right.

Siobhan:

And I'd assume, as much as you’re teaching them, you'd probably be learning from them as well.

Shannon:

Absolutely.

Alice:

Yeah, so, there's a few times when I've ran sessions on Google Classrooms. Other teachers were like, 'Oh, this is what we do in our faculty and you know, it's fantastic.' I'm like, 'Oh, I’ve never seen that before.' And so it's about, I guess, one of the best aspects is getting your colleagues to come together and just go and share, 'This is like what's working for me, working for my faculty, working for my subject area or year group.' And then other people will go, 'Oh, I’ve never seen that before. That would really work well in this context for me.'

Shannon:

Absolutely, and I think one of my very early mentors in my career. She used to say to me, she's like, 'I love working with beginning teachers and pre-service teachers when you have practicum students,' because we come straight out of university, for example, and you’re using all of these tools that are present at the moment and current, for example. She's like, 'I always learn a new thing, like every time I have a session with one of my beginning teachers.' And she was always like, 'I get so excited.' Because she had so many years of experience, and I was like a little sponge, like, 'Give me the knowledge.' But she was like, 'I always learn something from my beginning teachers as well in a technology sense, for example.'

Alice:

Yeah, definitely. Even when I'm supervising student teachers on their practicums, I learn so much from them. Just watching them teach, and you're like, 'Oh, I never, I would've never thought teaching something that way before.'

Shannon:

Yeah, and we've spoken about it on this podcast before. Like if you do get an opportunity to go and team teach with a colleague or go and observe another colleague. I suppose, in a high school setting that might look like some time out of your faculty area, for example, like in primary school, it's a little bit different, but yeah, it's a really valuable opportunity to go and observe and have that feedback with your colleagues as well.

Alice:

Yeah, definitely. One of the best, I think, learnings that I've had is watching PD/H/PE teachers. How they run a practical outdoor lesson and have their different soccer games all set up and they discuss strategies. They've got rotations. I'm tired just thinking about that.

Siobhan:

Well Alice, it seems like tech is your niche. I'd be interested to hear about if there was any particular moment in time that you have had in your teaching career that really solidified that pathway for you. Like was there a moment where you thought, 'Oh, this is my thing,' or

Shannon:

'This is my jam.'

Siobhan:

'This is where I'm going to make the biggest impact?’ Was there a moment for you inside or outside of that tech space that you've had throughout your career?

Alice:

You know teaching can be a very complex and challenging profession. So, I guess there was a moment when I was at Central train station in the city, in Sydney, and I just heard this voice going, 'Miss! Miss!' And it's this girl just walking really fast down the platform, and it was one of my students from one of my first schools, Auburn Girls High School, and I did remember her. She was in my Year 9 class, and high school teachers know their Year 9s are often very, very difficult to engage. And she didn't make it easy for me to engage her or the class. But she did come up to me, and she's like, 'Oh, Miss, guess what. I'm now studying to become a teacher because I loved your science lessons.' I was like, 'Aw.' Sometimes, you might think, 'Oh my gosh, that lesson was terrible,' or 'How am I going to get through

Siobhan:

'What impact am I making'

Alice:

To that Year 9 class or Year 10 class that just seemed so disinterested?' And you can be dancing or doing magic tricks in the front of the room, and they will just be like, 'Nah.'

Shannon:

So true.

Alice:

But you know, you are making a difference.

Shannon:

What a full circle moment, and now they're out there studying teaching.

Alice:

That's right, yeah, and science teaching as well

Shannon:

Oh my goodness.

Alice:

So, that makes it even better.

Siobhan:

Wow, that impact is insane. Just like the impact that that teacher had on you.

Alice:

That's right.

Siobhan:

Remind me their name.

Alice:

Oh, Ms Andre.

Siobhan:

Yeah, so the impact that Ms Andre had on you, you've then gone and had on that student. And then no doubt, that flow on effect will continue to happen for generations to come.

Alice:

Yeah, hopefully, yes.

Siobhan:

I think that’s the best part about the profession.

Shannon:

And speaking of the profession and the students we teach, what sort of lasting memory would you like to leave along the way for your students?

Alice:

I think I just want them to have a love of learning. Doesn't have to be in science. I mean, it would be great if it were science because that is the best subject, of course, no bias there.

Shannon:

No bias at all.

Alice:

But it’s about having that love of learning that there's always something new to learn about.

Shannon:

Lifelong learning.

Alice:

That's right, yes.

Siobhan:

Celebrate. No, I love that.

Siobhan:

Well they would take that into their professional lives as well outside of the classroom, so I think that's a really important message to leave on your students. No doubt you keep doing that each and every day, so well done to you.

Shannon:

Well, thank you for joining us, Alice. It's been really valuable to have you here on the couch, and I really like our new segment, 'Tech Time with Alice.’ So we'll be bringing that back.

Siobhan:

We'll workshop it, 'Tech Time/Tech Tools with Alice.’

Shannon:

Yeah, yeah.

Siobhan:

Take 2 on that one.

Shannon:

Yeah, we'll do some brainstorming. No, but sincerely, thank you for joining us. It's been lovely to have you on the couch with us here at the Teach NSW Podcast.

Alice:

Yep, thank you for having me.

Shannon:

You're welcome.

Siobhan:

Until next time. We'll see you in the next episode.

Shannon:

Bye.

Siobhan:

Bye.

Shannon:

Thank you for tuning into the Teach NSW Podcast, where we explore the dynamic world of education. Don't forget to follow, like, and subscribe to be notified when new episodes become available. You can find us on social media via our handle @teachNSW. Until next time, keep learning, keep teaching, and keep making a difference. The Teach NSW Podcast is a podcast by the Teach NSW team from the NSW Department of Education.