Siobhan:

I'd like to acknowledge that this episode of the Teach NSW Podcast was recorded on the Homelands of the Darug People. I'd like to pay respect to Elders past and present, and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and/or Torres Strait Islander peoples listening to the Teach NSW Podcast today.

Opening Credits:

Welcome to the Teach NSW Podcast. A podcast by teachers, for teachers. I'm Shannon, and I'm Siobhan.

Shannon:

Hi everyone. Welcome to this episode of the Teach NSW Podcast. We are joined today by the lovely Clare, who's here to talk to us about all things beginning teacher mentors and how to find the right mentor and what that looks like for you in your early career stages of being a teacher.

Siobhan:

Welcome.

Clare:

Thank you.

Shannon:

Would you like to tell us a little bit about yourself?

Clare:

Yeah, sure. So I'm Clare Letherbarrow and I work in the Attraction and Engagement Program Teacher Talent team, and my role focuses mainly on the beginning teacher and induction mentoring space. So, working with beginning teachers across all of New South Wales, which is fantastic. I'm also a English teacher.

Siobhan:

Same. Yeah, you're outnumbered Shannon.

Shannon:

I know. I don't know how I feel about this.

Clare:

Yeah, mainly worked as an English teacher, relieving head teacher, year advisor and early career mentor. So yeah. So it's great to be in this space and to be able to help nation, not nationwide, state statewide.

Siobhan:

I mean, we can, we can aim for nationwide.

Clare:

So yeah, that's what I'm currently doing as of this year.

Shannon:

Fantastic. Can you tell us a little about your journey into teaching? Being so experienced I'm sure you've experienced so many different year groups, opportunities in the school setting. We'd love to hear a little bit about that.

Siobhan:

Yeah, from grassroots to all the way to where you are now. We'd love to hear it all.

Clare:

Yep. Great. Well, I'm what you call a mid-career teacher. I was originally in PR and marketing for a number of years. I won't say how many because you'll end up doing the maths. And finally decided I needed something that really, I don't know, fed the soul a bit more for me. So, with two very small kids in tow, I went back to university and retrained to be a teacher and I haven't looked back, to be honest. I've loved every minute. So I also was a really passionate English student at school, loved my reading and creative writing. So it was sort of a bit of a no-brainer to become an English teacher, really. And, you know, I think teaching is in the blood. My mum's a retired AP, primary school, and my daughter is currently in her third year of study to be a primary school teacher. So, a lot of teachers in the family which is fantastic.

Shannon:

You're doing something right in that family.

Clare:

It's a good career, it's a good career. So, and yeah basically hit the ground running. When I left university and started school in the Hills district and it's just been fantastic and the depth of the different things you can experience as a teacher is just amazing, really. There's, you know, you're not just a teacher in the classroom. There's a lot of whole school things you can do. I think, I'm a real advocate for wellbeing in schools and welfare and I really enjoyed the welfare role as a teacher as well, doing year advising. It's such a rewarding, emotional time that you have with the students. And leading a faculty has been a fantastic experience too, working with colleagues that are such amazing practitioners and watching the curriculum being implemented within the school. It's just, yeah, it's been brilliant. So, I love every minute and enjoying working and being in the support staff now and helping those teachers.

Siobhan:

Yeah, in a lot of ways you're consistently giving back as a classroom teacher, giving back to your school community and to the students. And even now you're giving back to beginning teachers and helping them become the best that they can possibly be in the profession. So I feel like it's all equally as important. And we're so excited to have you because you have experience in beginning teacher mentorship. So I think we're looking to pick your brain a little bit about that today and speak a little bit about how our beginning teachers who are listening can get the most out of their support within the school network.

Clare:

Definitely, and it's so important. And I guess I was lucky, the last three or four years while I was at school, I was an early career mentor and I think I probably worked with about 30 to 35 early career teachers, you know, embarking on their teaching career, the first two years of that journey and working with them to sort of start off in their teaching as well as also looking at the accreditation process. So I'm happy to answer any questions. It's just a really important area. I really advocate for the support that beginning teachers should have because it's so important.

Siobhan:

I think let's jump right into it.

Clare:

Sure.

Siobhan:

Pretending that you're in the shoes of a beginning teacher.

Clare:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

Where would you look to? Where would you go? Who would you look to for support in your first two years? Because I think those two years are really critical. As the beginning teacher you're really just finding your feet. You feel like you should know it all and sometimes you don't. And it's really common to not know it all. In fact, you will go in there and you won't know everything because that's the purpose and the point. You're a graduate, you are just finding your feet in the classroom. So I suppose my question to you is what do you do in those first two years? Who do you turn to?

Clare:

Yeah, look, there's a whole range of support when you start at your new school, and it's okay actually not to know everything in those first two years. We actually sometimes say it can take up to five years before you really start to feel confident, and own it in the classroom and at the school level. So the first thing probably is to align yourself with the people that you're working in direct contact with every day. So whether that's your faculty or your fellow stage teachers, they're an amazing resource to be working with collegially and collaboratively. They can help you with resources, knowledge on behavior management for certain classes perhaps, that you know where your duties are. It's also important to get to know your senior exec. They will be able to assist you with the policies and procedures of the school. And of course, they will help you with your two-year journey, if you like, of easing into the school and helping you with your defining and focusing on your practice really.

Siobhan:

Let's not forget, shout out to the SAS staff, school administrative and support staff.

Clare:

They're the backbone of a school.

Siobhan:

They are the backbone of a school.

Clare:

The SAS staff and also our support learning officers because they are a mine full of information on students and classes and yeah, everybody works together in a school. But yes, we definitely need those groups of people to keep us ticking over and to keep us sane actually as well.

Siobhan:

And it's like they actually form part of your support network because they are there to help you. It's within their role and a lot of times you will find yourself having an SLSO within the classroom who can help you and you're there to guide them as much as they're there to guide you. Because if you're new to a school, they'll probably know more about the students than you do at that point. So tap into that source of knowledge and really make the most of them within the classroom. Before you, you know, think that you're on your own, you're certainly not alone within the school. And if you do feel that sense, I would encourage people to reach out to your networks across the school and find a connection with somebody.

Clare:

That’s right. And I also highly encourage that you, if there are other early career teachers at your school to connect with them as well.

Siobhan:

You are your own network.

Clare:

They're really great at having honest conversations with you and helpful conversations, and also too the experienced teachers as well. Just don't sort of stay within your faculty or your stage, try and build those connections at school, because it's really important once you have those relationships and support networks, it does make your life a lot easier and you're more happy to go to school every day.

Shannon:

Absolutely. And I love how you talk about like the connection and relationships with your peers. When I started teaching in a full-time capacity, there were two other girls that we all started, come straight out of uni together and we landed at the same school and having that sort of relationship where I had two other people who we were all going through the same thing. We were all on different stages, but we would sort of, we'd meet on a Friday to mark our homework together before we went home for the weekend. And I honestly like, I think those times,, marking that homework together with our cute little stamps and just talking about the week and being able to debrief with people who understood it, was so valuable.

Clare:

Yeah, they become like your second family, really. I now go on holidays with people that I work with in my faculty and I count them as my closest friends. And yeah, you are with these people a lot of hours every day and they can be an amazing support network for you.

Siobhan:

I would certainly encourage people to get involved. I know for me in my first year I was invited to trivia, the Tuesday night trivia at the local pub and for me it was actually one of the best parts of the week because although let's acknowledge the fact you are probably tired.

Clare:

Correct.

Siobhan:

But you go and they will refill your cup almost and you are outside of that teaching environment, and in this, you know, this real people environment, the pub, and it can actually form greater connections with the staff as well. And you're right, have a bit of a vent.

Shannon:

It's people who get it.

Clare:

It is. Yeah. And you know, it's okay if you don't find that sort of connection in your faculty or stage leaders look across the school, you know, there will be somebody there because, you know, we go on about building those connections with our students. But I think it's equally as important to build those connections with your colleagues as well.

Siobhan:

And so we might have some listeners who are thinking, I work in a really small school like there aren't that many colleagues to tap into. So what advice would you give to them? Are there online resources?

Clare:

Yeah, go wider. And you know, we have the beauty of online now.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

So there are networks, there are, you know there could be a network within your school directorate, there's online networks, look at social media, there's often groups that either relate to your perhaps KLA that you can join and discuss with.

Siobhan:

There's Statewide Staffrooms, so all NSW public school teachers can access Statewide Staffrooms, which are just run through Microsoft Teams. And it's colleagues from all over the state who share resources, you can post in the chat and just ask for advice.

Shannon:

Opportunities for your students. I've often seen like competitions come up that I knew I had, you know, some students who are really passionate about the area of STEM, for example. I looked at that as an opportunity to bring into my classroom as well.

Clare:

And there's also too, the Beginning Teachers Viva Engage, formerly the Yammer page.

Shannon:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

That can be really helpful for teachers just starting out with other fellow career teachers.

Siobhan:

So is there a common place in the department where a beginning teacher can go to, like on a website?

Clare:

Yes. So if we're going to talk resources for beginning teachers, we have some amazing, really useful tips and links for beginning teachers to access. I guess a first port of call I would recommend is go check out the Beginning Teachers Information Hub. That is basically the one-stop shop for you in terms of looking at information on induction, you can access through the induction hub, the induction checklist, which can be a really useful tool for you to sort of tick off what you need to maybe cover off in those first six months of starting. So even just a simple, you know, your first day or even before your first day going, making a contact with that school, organising a visit to the school, accessing the relevant school information, class times, bell times, you know, where duties are.

Siobhan:

Is there a shared Google Drive or Microsoft SharePoint, are there resources?

Clare:

So you can access that. There's also on the induction hub too, apersonalised induction planner for beginning teachers. Where you can make notes and record what you've done so far as you start at school. There's also the Strong Start, Great Teachers suite of resources, if you like, and the department has put together basically a framework of four phases of induction into teaching. So you have orientation, developing focus, refining practice and obviously then the Proficient accreditation. And there's a whole lot of information on there, templates that they can use, resources in terms of helping them with classroom management. There's e-learning modules that you can access for the different key practices. So there's also information on mentoring, the funding. The list goes on, all links to staff essentials really. So we've also created the Beginning Teachers Learning Pathway, which also maps out that phase, those four phases and has all the relevant links a new teacher would need to access in the first two years of teaching. So I also recommend, if it's not already attached, when you get into your staff portal, the Q+ tile, it's so great in terms of ease of recording accreditation as well as your professional development plans when you get to that stage.

Shannon:

It's very swish, the new portal. And we've gone digital with our professional development plan. It's really exciting.

Siobhan:

Let's backtrack, for a beginning teacher who's probably like 'what's a staff portal? What's a Q+ tile?’

Shannon:

What are all these acronyms?

Siobhan:

This is like one of the most important things I feel like as a beginning teacher, you get in and you’re like, how do I log on and find things? So if you type in, on Google, or your preferred search engine, ‘staff portal’ and log in using your Department of Education credentials, there will be a home page that comes up and it has some pre-selected tiles on there. So it will usually be like your email, access to G Suite or Microsoft Essentials, but you can actually edit your staff portal.

Shannon:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

And you can add the tiles or apps that you find most useful. And so Q+ is one that we're talking about because it's almost like a one-stop shop for all your accreditation and professional learning needs, and it keeps it tracked for you all together in one place. Previously, you had to access a lot of different platforms, but now it's all just in the one. 100% add Q+ to your staff portal.

Clare:

It's fantastic, it really is. You know, you get a really quick overview of where you're at with your goal setting and when you're up to your accreditation phase as well. You've got the link, easy link to eTams and NESA.

Shannon:

It's really finessed the whole process.

Clare:

Yes, it has.

Shannon:

But not only for you as a professional, but also for your supervisor as well.

Clare:

Correct.

Shannon:

They have access to your goals, they can go in and put comments and sort of help you along the way with how you're tracking and, you know, look for opportunities as well. If they know what your goals are, they sort of can look to help you professionally and tailor professional development towards what you need.

Siobhan:

Yeah. So what we're talking about right now for those who aren't familiar, is a PDP. So, I feel like in my first year I got there they were like ‘Write your PDP’, I'm like 'PD what? PD who? What does PDP stand for?' Personal development plan, it's guided off a framework. Essentially every year you get to set goals for yourself and obviously as a beginning teacher, like you're going to set those graduate-level goals. It could be like, getting to know your students, you know, and how they learn. Often, they link to the standards, but you are encouraged and it depends on the school you're at. Some schools have a certain way they like their staff to write their PDP. But you're often encouraged to have a whole-school goal, a faculty or stage goal and then a personal goal. So, what you do is you set the goals at the start of the year, you reflect halfway through the year, but you also say, 'What do I need to achieve this goal? What will I need?' And that's where you can say, 'Alright, if my goal is to learn how to better manage my classroom, well, I would like to go to a professional development session where I have 20 hours focused on classroom management strategies.'

Shannon:

Absolutely.

Siobhan:

And the school is encouraged to provide you with that opportunity.

Clare:

Yeah, exactly.

Siobhan:

If there's something that you want to do, write it in your PDP because often times you need to end up achieving that goal. So it's a bit more of a driver for you to actually go to those conferences or professional learning sessions or have the funding to do an online module or extra time away from class to get some more mentorship in that area.

Clare:

And you used a really good word there, reflection. And the purpose of that, I think as teachers, we're always reflecting, and we should be and how we sort of achieve those goals, how we do in our classes, how we feel about our day. And reflection is a really good tool to have, to be able to keep refining your practice as well.

Siobhan:

How do you, how do you reflect? Like we say it as if we know how to do it already, but some people might not know how. How do you actually reflect on your practice?

Clare:

Yeah, it's a good question actually. There is actually a bite-size e-learning module on self-reflection that people can do, and it gives you some ideas and tools of ways to reflect. And I guess there's different levels of reflecting too. I think one of the things is we can be really hard on ourselves as teachers and we want every lesson to be perfect and we want everything to go right the first time.

Siobhan:

And it won't.

Clare:

It doesn't, no, it's not utopia. So, I think it's important to reflect sometimes, maybe when it's at the end of the day, just to have a go at what worked best for you. Maybe what would you have done different after that lesson or interaction with the student, perhaps. Looking at ways of maybe managing that differently next time. And you can either reflect by journaling, talking to a colleague, writing down notes, if you like. And I think sometimes if you can do that bit of self-reflection at the end of the day, it might help alleviate the 2am, you know, mind ticking over.

Siobhan:

Should I have said yes to that student who wanted to go to the bathroom while I was delivering the most important lesson of their life? Maybe.

Clare:

You know, self-reflection can take many different forms, but that's just sort of some ideas, especially when you're starting out.

Siobhan:

Yes.

Clare:

Yeah.

Siobhan:

I think it's really important to often times when people reflect, they might look at it as, well I need to reflect on what I didn't do very well. But it's really important to start with what actually went well and what would I like to do again and then what could I change for next time?

Clare:

Yeah, yeah.

Shannon:

And it can be hard as a beginning teacher. I think back to myself, so excited, fresh out of university, and I just had these expectations that were skyscraper high. Everything had to be perfect. I was driving myself insane almost, you know, printing all these resources, laminating everything. It didn't matter. The kids were still going to learn at the end of the day, whether I had a rainbow-coloured classroom or whether I had handwritten posters.

Clare:

Yes.

Shannon:

But that took me some time to learn. And I was provided with a mentor who actually had just retired from a long career in teaching. She had plus 30 years under her belt, and she actually came back and facilitated mentorship for us beginning teachers, so lucky. And I remember her telling, like saying to me, she's like, 'Shannon, you don't have to have it all figured out.'

Clare:

That's right. You certainly don't.

Shannon:

Just give yourself a break. And I think like until I sat down and like, was like, ‘Wow, okay, yeah, you're right, I don't have to have it figured out’. But we do, we come out of uni and we're so excited. We have high expectations for ourselves, but we have to look after ourselves because it's not realistic.

Clare:

Well, and that's so true. I mean, I think nothing can prepare you for the emotional investment you have when you become a teacher. Right. And we're all very passionate practitioners and when we do come out of university and transition into schools, it is exciting, but it also can be really overwhelming and it is really important to take that self-care and not be too hard on yourself. And it's easier said than done. I know.

Shannon:

It takes time and practise.

Clare:

It does, it does. You've got to be mindful of that. You know, especially when you're first starting at an appointment, the first two terms really should just be you easing into your new school, just learning the processes, the policies, the kids in your class, more importantly. Build that rapport with your students. You can create your learning environment down the track. Like you say, you don't need to have all the pretty posters to start with as much as we do like our classrooms to look fantastic. But I think it's really building that rapport with students first and those connections and just being kind to yourself and that confidence will come and it does. And hopefully by the end of the second term, you're starting to feel it. You know, you've gone from prac where you still had another teacher in the classroom. So to be in a classroom, I remember the first time I was in the classroom by myself, I went 'Oh my goodness, I'm it'.

Siobhan:

I'm looking for the adult in the room.

Clare:

I know. And that's when you realise, it's me. So, it's important just to take your time. And the other thing too I want to say as well, it's actually ok to say no to some things when you first start out. People will tell you, 'You should take on this whole-school initiative, it'll be great for your CV'.

Shannon:

‘Teach the dance.’

Clare:

So, where possible just say, you know, you're focusing, first of all and foremost on your teaching as you're starting out. You don't feel like you have to jump on everything at school. That time will come. I'll guarantee you, there's always jobs to be done at school, extracurricular and fantastic things that you can be involved in at school level, but definitely for so those first two or three terms just focus on your teaching and learning and delivering great lessons. And getting to know your students.

Siobhan:

I agree. My first full-time teaching load was at a selective high school, so there was a little bit of imposter syndrome there for me as well. Not only was I starting my first teaching role, but I sort of put a lot of pressure on myself. Okay I'm teaching, you know, selective students. I'm teaching a Year 12 Advanced English class, like this, it's a lot happening at the same time. And I think that I put a lot of time and effort into just getting to know the students first and that paid dividends in the end.

Clare:

So much so, especially too with classroom management.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

And you know, I hate to say it, but fake it till you make it. Go in there with that confidence that you know exactly what you're doing. The kids can sniff and smell fear a mile away. Don't let them buy into that.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

But, you know, taking time, not just about delivering fantastic lessons, but actually getting to know your students, especially those first few lessons, you know, find out what their interests are. Look at the information the school has on your class. There may be wellbeing, learning aspects that you need to take into consideration when you're starting off with your class. Be firm, be kind, be caring but most of all be consistent. And I really firmly believe that if you put that hard yards in, in that sort of first or second term, you pay dividends by the end of the year and it should hopefully, you know, minimise the behavioural classroom management issues you may encounter.

Siobhan:

All students need routine and structure.

Clare:

Correct.

Siobhan:

So and I've noticed that obviously teaching at a selective school, a lot of the students are very driven. And so, I've sort of thought I could forgo the classroom management aspects. But however, I found that if I set the scene at the start of the lesson, two lines at the door, you don't enter before I open the door and allow you to come into the classroom and learn. Here’s what I'd like you to have out at the door before you even come into the classroom, this is my expectation. I then took that on into a co-educational 7 to 10 school, and I feel like it's the same for all kids.

Clare:

It is.

Siobhan:

That all students need routine, structure, consistency. They need to know, ‘When I have Miss Rossenrode, this is what she expects from me’ and you'll find that it happens. Don't, I suppose, sway from that, as much as you as a beginning teacher, you think I just want them to like me. I want them to think that I'm nice to them. But in fact, setting boundaries is going to result in a safer classroom.

Shannon:

Yes.

Clare:

It is. And having those rules and routines and going in with those high expectations is really important. We can be friendly, but we don't need to be their friends and it does pay dividends if you can focus that. And little things, like you mentioned there like lining up before class, making sure you've got your equipment out ready to go. They may seem like simple things, but they do set a routine and expectation of your class.

Siobhan:

I was scared to even set a seating plan.

Clare:

Seating plans are sort of like your 101.

Siobhan:

I agree, I was thinking, I don't know, if I was a student I'd hate to be told where to sit, but for a lot of students, it makes them feel comfortable because like you said before, some students might have independent learning plans, which means they need to sit at the front of the classroom or at the back with no one behind them. There's a lot of different reasons. So seating plans are there for the safety of the students, but also the consistency. I think there's some comfort for them in knowing that's my that's my seat, that's where I go.

Clare:

And seating plans sometimes help students self-regulate a bit easier, they're not maybe be distracted by peers and a seating plan should be classified in the way you look at your learning environment that you're setting out in your classroom. And ultimately we're there to provide a safe and, you know, warm environment that students can learn in. And don't be afraid to use a seating plan. It might actually take you, especially if you're new to the class.

Siobhan:

To get the right seating plan.

Clare:

Yeah, to get the right seating plan. You know, I've had versions where I'm up to version five.

Siobhan:

Once you find it though, it's like, mwah.

Clare:

I should not have seated those two together. Why did I do that? It's not working. So, be prepared to tweak things. That's the other thing. Your resources, that you put in place don't always have to be perfect from day one and work with the kids. And sometimes it's great to negotiate class rules with the students so they have ownership of what's acceptable in the classroom, and yeah.

Shannon:

I'd love to talk a little bit about what mentoring can look like. For example, a big part of when I was an early career teacher in my first two years, I was really supported to have executives or more senior members of staff with more experience than me come into my classroom and provide lessons so that I could observe them, or I would have the opportunity to go and observe another colleague. And I think that was something that was so powerful for me as a beginning teacher and something that I carried through after those beginning teacher years. I know when I had RFF, which is release from face-to-face teaching time, I would ask colleagues, you know, 'I heard you were doing something really cool in science, that you're integrating this technology. Like, would you mind if I came in and had a look? I'd love to sort of bring it back into my classroom'. Could you talk a little bit about that and how important observations are?

Clare:

Definitely, observations are vital I think, in developing yourself as a teacher. And I think as early career teachers, we're really open to that idea of observing and having other, don't be afraid of having other people come into your classroom, they're not there to criticise you. You can do observations with your direct mentor that you might be working with that has been assigned to you and you can have conversations about, you know, different strategies that you want to maybe perhaps improve on or what sort of standards you're looking to working towards more and they can help you there. Definitely working with, or asking more experienced teachers, to be able to go into their classroom as well is so useful. Especially, you know, if you've got, for example, certain students that are in perhaps Year 9 maths class that are behaving in certain way, but you want to check out what they're doing in Science or English to see what that teacher's doing and what strategies they have in place can be so helpful. So observations also form part of your PDP too, your professional plans as well, to help you work through those goals. And you know, they don't always have to be a whole lesson.

Siobhan:

Correct.

Clare:

You know, a mini chunk of a lesson. You might just sort of say, 'Hey can you come in and observe how I actually go with introducing the learning criteria of this lesson?' Or 'Let me know how my use of IT goes', or 'I really want to trial this new thing.’

Siobhan:

It's important to have a focus. Don't just invite someone into the classroom and say, 'Watch me', 'I'd like you to watch me do X, Y, Z, or just X. Yeah, and see if I nail that.’

Clare:

Yeah, exactly.

Siobhan:

'Or what I can do to improve it.’

Clare:

And there's some really useful observation templates on the Beginning Teacher Information Hub that you can use to help guide those conversations regarding observations and they sort of are, you can align them to the Standards or you can just have informal conversations, but they might be also worthwhile having a look at. But also too, ask your mentor, your mentor can help liaise with other teachers in the school if you don't feel confident enough to go up to teachers, especially when you’re new.

Shannon:

You're still learning.

Clare:

Yeah, that's right. I'm still trying to learn names. Right.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

So, you know, utilise your mentor or like the DP or APs to maybe liaise on your behalf.

Shannon:

Yeah.

Clare:

And they can help you out there.

Shannon:

I love how you've mentioned the teaching Standards throughout as well, because as you come towards your second year of full-time teaching, you are working towards getting your proficiency in your accreditation.

Clare:

Yeah.

Shannon:

So it's really good to see that all these things that you're just doing in your job, they all align to the Standards. You're already, you know, working towards the Standards and it sort of breaks down that, I suppose, stature that your accreditation is this big hard task that you have to do. You're already doing it. It's just about piecing it all together.

Clare:

It's so true. And I'm so glad you said that because accreditation is like, I don't know, this is like a scary, urban myth that, you know, takes forever.

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

You know, NESA and the department are always working at, you know, streamlining that and making it more easy and approachable for teachers to complete and do. But it is an important process and it's also part of a reflection process too, doing your accreditation and looking at the examples you do and how you annotate that. But for early career teachers, again, we often get asked as mentors, 'When can I start doing my accreditation?'

Siobhan:

Yeah.

Clare:

Because you hear so much about it, especially at uni as well. And that's, I tend to encourage focus, again, like I say, those first two or three terms, focus on your teaching and refining your practice first and then you can sort of start looking at the accreditation. You know, there are timeframes that you are allowed to do the accreditation within and your mentor can guide you through those. But, as you said, you are doing it anyway and you will have a whole suite of examples that you can use for your accreditation by nature of what you're doing, what you're creating anyway. And if you continue to use the language of the Australian Professional Teaching Standards, it will just become second nature in how you look at it, reflect and annotate that evidence. But when you're first starting out though, don't panic about accreditation. It's quite easy on eTams, which is the online submission now and where you can store your comments, annotations and your supervisors can access that as well.

Siobhan:

And in fact, all pre-service teachers before they graduate, they need to complete at university the GTPA or TPA, whatever your university or institution calls it. Your TPA is your accreditation is essentially a mini, or a larger version of the TPA anyway. What you do in your GTPA is,

Clare:

Very similar.

Siobhan:

Very, very similar. So I thought it was one of the most useful pieces of work I did at university, because when it came time to completing my accreditation, I went, ‘I've already done an assessment where I've collected evidence, reflected on the evidence and linked it to the teaching Standards.’

Clare:

That's right. So you've already done it.

Siobhan:

That's what your accreditation is in a nutshell.

Shannon:

You have a trial run.

Clare:

You have a trial run. So you will be fine when it comes to accreditation, and you are assigned someone at school to help you with that process. So don't feel like you have to do it on your own. I remember when I was doing my accreditation, that was back in the day when it was a massive folder of, you know, and it took a long time. Now it's a fantastic process, streamlined, great self-reflection tool. And yeah, it really helps refine your practice as a teacher.

Siobhan:

So that's one common question that you get asked from beginning teachers. Are there any other common questions that you get asked as a beginning teacher mentor?

Clare:

I know that we've probably touched on a little bit already, but the biggest probably is classroom management.

Shannon:

Yeah.

Clare:

‘How do I build strategies for classroom management? How do I improve my classroom management?’ And as we've already said, going into a classroom can be overwhelming but it's also exciting. We've talked about how you need to be consistent, set those rules and routines. We do have an e-learning module that you can access from Strong Start, Great Teachers, which has a whole lot of quick strategies on classroom management. There's a lot of professional learning that you can access on MyPL as well that help you refine and understand classroom management. Tap in to your supervisors, etcetera. Look at the school's behaviour policies on how they deal with behaviour. There's often a chain of, you know, consequences.

Shannon:

What to do.

Siobhan:

Who to refer behaviour to.

Clare:

And, you know, certain schools will use different programs and software to help record those things. Essential, that's right, that you can access. Looking at just different cues in the classroom, being proactive in your teaching. Movement is so important in the classroom and you can get so much from just standing next to somebody and using your eyes.

Siobhan:

You don't even need to speak sometimes.

Clare:

So, you know, powerful non-verbal gestures can help a lot, but moving around, I think sometimes there can be a tendency now that we're using laptops a lot, the smart board, it's really important as teachers to remind ourselves to get up from our desk and keep moving and you can sort of better supervise. Managing behaviour straight away and having those different degrees of consequences in terms of addressing that. And just understanding, too, that every day is a different day. What works today, might not work tomorrow, and you know because our kids are coming to class with very much external factors and we don't know what's happened.

Siobhan:

They call it the invisible backpack.

Clare:

Yes, the invisible backpack.

Siobhan:

You can't see the load that they’re carrying on them.

Clare:

No and that's so true.

Siobhan:

And you can’t guess. We're human, we can't guess.

Clare:

And I think if you can keep that invisible backpack in your mind, it gives that sense of empathy that you have towards your students and it helps you also manage and regulate your own emotional reaction to behaviours in classrooms. Because if you sort of say to yourself hang on a minute, you don't know what this person's gone through this morning before they even got to school. Is this a sword to die on, in terms of the way I'm reacting to their behaviour?

Shannon:

And I love how everything you've just mentioned about classroom management and how important that is, it really all stems back to knowing your students at the end of the day.

Clare:

Yeah.

Shannon:

And like we talked about, putting in the effort at the beginning of the year to get to know those students. And I know it looks different in each setting what opportunity that you may have to do that or what capacity. Something I love to do and I am so intrigued to read them at the end of the day, I do a little bit of a survey.

Clare:

Yes.

Shannon:

I do like to do one at the beginning of the year and I also like to do a celebration survey at the end of the year.

Clare:

That's so nice.

Siobhan:

That's how to make a survey sound fun, it's a celebration survey.

Shannon:

And I do them digitally so that we can keep track of them. And also it helps me use that as an assessment, I'm a primary school teacher, so I can use that to assess their ICT capabilities.

Siobhan:

Double whammy.

Shannon:

I know. She's a thinker.

Siobhan:

Work smarter, not harder.

Shannon:

So I do it on Microsoft forms. Ask them a couple of questions about their interests, you know, things that they've appreciated in a previous teacher. So attributes and things that made them feel important and feel valued in the classroom. And I also share at the end of the year, we look back at their start of the year survey and the end of the year survey, and that has such a phenomenal impact on the students. And they're like, ‘Oh my goodness’, even they say, you know, 'Look how I wrote that sentence, that grammar is not even correct.’

Siobhan:

‘I was so silly back then.’

Shannon:

But little things like that.

Siobhan:

It's actually a visible reflection of their learning and their growth.

Shannon:

Yeah, and you can get so much out of it.

Clare:

It's a great way to quickly assess your students. I was probably a bit more old-school in terms of I asked them to write a letter.

Siobhan:

Which, go for it, that is still such a good strategy.

Clare:

Yeah, I think you get so much and you know they like talking about themselves and you can get one or two elements out of that, that can generate so much conversation.

Siobhan:

And also, you know, a lot of teachers like to write a reply. It's something that the students actually hold on to as a momento.

Clare:

Yeah. I've actually had some finish Year 12 and actually say 'Miss, I've still got that letter that you wrote to me.’ It's just so sweet, but it just shows how important they take, they do, you know, value that sort of. And that's a different way of feedback, right?

Shannon:

Oh, 100%.

Siobhan:

And we're not asking you to go into a classroom and tell your students everything about your life. Here's where I live, here's the name of every person in my family tree. We're asking you to form some general connections that are more on a broad scale. So for me, at the start of every lesson, I would put up photos of my dog, Todd. Shout out to Todd. Kids can always relate to pets, cats, dogs. ‘Are you a cat, or dog person?’ Some kid in the classroom might have a pet mouse. You never know. I always share the name of my favourite football team with them, and then they might go, 'I don't even like footy.’ And then you can have that whole discussion 'Who do you like then? Who do you support?'

Clare:

Sport's a great one, that can last a whole term.

Shannon:

You can almost regret that one, in some ways.

Siobhan:

Just those little connections, I think are really important because then, at the start of a lesson, instead of saying, you know, 'Take your hat off and come and sit inside', you can then say, 'Hey, I saw the Sharks lost on the weekend.' And then sort of form that connection.

Shannon:

It's that relationship, isn't it?

Clare:

And having said that too. A lot of us are actually put on sport duty.

Siobhan:

Well, I'm now like the world's best Oztag coach and I've never played a game of Oztag in my life.

Clare:

You know what I love about that, though? Sometimes you have students that may be not, you know, engaged in your classroom, but you get to see a whole other side and even like, you know, at creative performances and things like that. So I encourage you as an early career teacher to experience looking at the students in different settings and formats because you will see sometimes a completely different side. And that also helps then if they're, especially in your class, you know, you can bring those conversations up as well.

Shannon:

Yes, I love to hear it. I would love to take some time and hear a little bit about your role that you do now within the educational support staff and what that looks like for you.

Clare:

Yeah, sure. So we are lucky to work with beginning teachers across all of New South Wales and basically our role is to support schools and their beginning teachers with the mentoring and induction process. So that could look like anything from presenting at network conferences. I've just recently done one in regional New South Wales, which was, we had I think about 50 beginning teachers there. And that's really important too because they all can feel quite isolated and live geographically quite a distance. So to bring them all together, where they can work together is fantastic. We provide support to senior exec in schools in terms of developing mentoring programs and how they can best support their beginning teachers and then also at grassroot level, if you like, we also do virtual mentoring with some beginning teachers. If they can't get access to a mentor for a variety of reasons. So I've just recently gone out to some of the schools there where I virtually mentor and meet the teachers in person. It's just fantastic. And to be honest, it's such an honour and privilege working with early career teachers, you guys that are out there, because to watch your career evolve and, you know, induct yourself into teaching as a profession is fantastic. It's actually really positive to see how the comments around the profession are starting to change, which is really important. And being a teacher is one the best careers that you could possibly undertake, I think. Yes, it's challenging. Yes, it has, you know, it can feel overwhelming and the workload can be huge sometimes. But, to have the light bulb moments that you get in the class sometimes or to know you're the only consistent, caring person in a student's life is just mind-blowing and does feed the soul. And basically what I tell my daughter, is just don't be too hard on yourself. We've talked about this briefly, but it's such a key and you've, you're choosing teaching for a reason and that is because obviously you're able to connect with people. You have a passion perhaps about a certain subject that you want to be able to, you know, teach people about basically. So I highly recommend it. There's so many different things you can do as a teacher as well, not just inside the classroom, but also outside the classroom at a school. So you know, why wouldn't you want to be a teacher?

Siobhan:

That's great advice. A great message.

Shannon:

Love it.

Siobhan:

I love it. Thank you so much for joining us today on the Teach NSW Podcast. Thank you Clare, for taking the time out of your day to come and speak to us. If you liked this episode, be sure to share it with somebody that you know, who might benefit from it. Share it with your friends, family, your cat, your dog, whoever might want to listen.

Shannon:

Your pet goldfish.

Siobhan:

Your pet goldfish. We don’t mind. We hope to see you next time on our next episode of the Teach NSW Podcast. Stay in touch. Bye.

Shannon:

Thank you for tuning in to the Teach NSW Podcast, where we explore the dynamic world of education. Don't forget to follow, like and subscribe to be notified when new episodes become available. You can find us on social media via our handle @TeachNSW. Until next time, keep learning, keep teaching and keep making a difference. The Teach NSW Podcast is a podcast by the Teach NSW team from the NSW Department of Education.